Hey ZM - good to see you! I think it is a great idea to have a crew of people out looking for environmental problems and bringing them to public attention - that is worth a Civic Innovation Lab grant!

What are they doing wrong here? Should they be using a more eco-friendly cleaner... not letting it drain into a storm sewer.... pouring it down their utility drain?

And nice to see http://northcoastgreenspieler.blogspot.com/2009/05/i-love-realneous.html - me too!

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 (I'm nOt referring to you here, Norm) grew up with bleach in everything. I'm not sure enough people know not to use it. We stopped using it a few years back. I think people also misjudge the amount they need to sanitize something.

Don't the storm sewers drain into the lake? I think a more appropriate disposal, if they have to use bleach, would be the utility drain.

Nice blog, btw.

Is that an MS4 storm drain?  If not then bleach going into it mean nothing it will go to place that uses much more bleach. 

If it is then those that have access to it should be aware that it is not part of the POTW and that it discharges directly into the natural water shed. An MS4 drain needs signage, otherwise people that have access to it may have no idea what they are doing when they dump chemicals in it.

City of lakewood storm water management  

Bleach is pesticide? Just a word, its a chemical compound, that kills organisms, that’s why people use it, to kill organism like bacteria and viruses. To call Bleach a pesticide is like calling bacteria and viruses pests, it is not incorrect but more a less statement of the obvious?   Do statements of the obvious suprise you?   

I think the MS4 drains and bussinesses and homes around them need to know that they are directly connected to the lake and or river.   I have seen MS4 drains and the ones that I have seen have lables on them, does that one?   

Why not call the city and ask is it?  Then does the owner of the bussiness know that?   Why make them look bad?  Is that how education works...with a smack to the head? 

None of this is or should be anyhting that most on this site already know right!  So when addressing the little things then each time over and over you have to do it completely or what?  Nothing changes? 

Add me on Facebook, dude.  You are the man.

did someone say Civic Innovation Lab Grant?   That sounds like we could really heighten awareness of the issues!  Some one be in touch..i'd look forward to it.

zM

Zm-

Not sure why you would single out this particular restaurant for doing something that they, and all food service providers, are required to do by the health department for good reason, and something I want any restaurant to do: be clean. Food-born pathogens are a serious concern and cause thousands of deaths worldwide every year. Many of these deaths are little kids.

I'm an environmental professional, and I'm equally concerned about the use of chlorine and the generation of THMs and other degradation products. There are other disinfecting methods, but few if any that are as effective, cheap, and come with the realtively small toxilogical exposure risk, as sodium hypochlorite. Small time business owners would not be able to maintain the cleanliness standards required by law, and desired by customers with exotic and less effective methods. It sounds like this restaurant is being a good food-service citizen, keeping things clean.

I just think we need to focus on the huge emitters of industrial pollution, who's toxic output is measured in TONS and TONS of really toxic chemicals, every day-not in bucket fulls. Some extremely dilute bleach water down the drain, and these guys are being referred to as a "local business poluting our great land"? I think this is really really misguided. This kind of emision is miniscule, campared to large quantity industrial facilities, many of which are right here in Cleveland. I know you know these things ZM. 

Go after those guys. 

Regards,

SVH

I worked in a restaurant for 4 years here in NEO where bleach water was (when I first arrived) routinely tossed out on the pavement to make its way to the stormdrain and on to the lake. The simple solution is to put it into the sanitary sewer - every kitchen should have a sink or easier still, a utility drian where mop buckets can be dumped.  If you're an environmental professional, you should know that Nonpoint Source Pollution is the curreent big challenge. These do's and don'ts around the home should help Melt get their game on track.

Susan-

I'm very familiar with the issues surrounding nonpoint source pollution. No argument there, a serious issue.  This may be a combined sewer, I don't know. Look, I'm concerned about serious chemical exposures that we all experience daily.

I guess what troubles me the most are forums like this where people can hide behind pseudonymns and aliases and make all kinds of accusations based on conjecture and supposition.  ZM  didn't really  know  what was being discharged down that drain. Didn't really know if that was a combined sewer or not.  But, yet leveled some serious allegations against these restaurant guys, in a public forum, with no real information. This is worrisome. I think if someone really wanted to promote positive change with these folks in the context of nonpoint source polution, they would call the owners, talk to them,  voice the concerns, offer some constructive suggestions, just like you probably did at the restaurant that you worked at, when you say what they were doing. Something better than mudslinging based on assumptions, behind their back. That's gutless.

I was driving by another much loved Cleveland restaurant today - this one on Mayfield, in Little Italy - and an employee was dumping their mop-bucket of dirty water into the storm sewer drain... headed for Lake Erie or sewage treatment?

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